Obamacare Dead

Farstar

Farstar

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<object width="560" height="340"><object width="560" height="340">Lets see if this works

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hoooorayyyyyyy, people with no health insurance can just go fuck themselves!! fuck them!!!
And I can't wait to be paying insane sums of money to get healthcare, and then be denied coverage once i get sick!!!! WOOHOOO
 
they cannot deny you care if you are sick; if that wasn't ture dead homeless people would line the streets. Why should you pay ridiculous taxes for everybody? Have you been to Canada? ask Buck & Fasty how much GST & PST they pay for all their shit? Why do Canadians come to America for specialized treatments? Government cannot run businesses; health care, car, & banks...Laissez-faire. But, I can go on on about ecomomics; but, once you start paying over 10 grand in income tax you will realize, where the fuck does all my money go?..some people want a free ride
 
Not to mention it would have seriously cut into the operating funds of all NON-Municipal ambulance services. I.E. put a hell of alot of people like me out of a job.
 
Exactly. People who think this Healthcare Bill, if that's what you call it, will solve things. Nope. it will only make it worse. You can't bleed hardworking Americans with taxes to pay for those who don't work and get everything paid for by the government anyways. Yes, there are some good people out there that can't afford health insurance, but you don't fix that with government regulation. You fix that by preventing ambulance chasing lawyers and other thieves from milking the current system. You want to make it more streamlined, not more bureaucratic. This bill would DECIDE who gets treatment, not who can pay for it. It would give the government the right to decide if you live or die, not you and your doctors. Healthcare needs to be fixed, yes, but this is not the way.

A great American thinker, Herman Cain, had this to say about the new Healthcare system and what it would do to America. He has an alternative, as do many prominent independent thinkers both in congress and in the public sector. But the Democratic majority refuses to let anyone propose a bill that does not give them complete control over us.

"My most recent column highlighted the massive ignorance about the U.S. health care system. Too many people want to fix the leaks in our health care roof by blowing up the building. Here’s a novel idea, let’s just fix the leaks in the roof, and here are seven solutions by Sally Pipes of the Pacific Research Institute.

Pipes explains each solution in more detail in her book, The Top Ten Myths of American Health Care, but these brief explanations will make you more knowledgeable about solutions to our health care system than 90 percent of the voting public. Taken together, there would be no involuntary leaks in the roof.

Change the tax code. Level the playing field by allowing employees to have the same tax deductibility rules as employers, which would make it possible for the employees to buy employee-owned health insurance accounts. People would then make more prudent choices, because it would be their money and not their employer’s money.

Reduce costly government mandates and regulations. Just look at Medicare and Medicaid. The more the government tries to control costs with mandates and regulations, the more costs go up and the quality of care goes down.

Allow the purchase of insurance across state lines. This one is more controversial, because the states are vastly different concerning mandated coverage and insurance regulations. But it is worth exploring for the sake of enhanced competition.

Expand Health Savings Accounts (HSAs). These accounts are available at most banks and allow you to save money tax-free for current and future health care expenses. But as usual, the government has set stupid limitations and regulations that discourage their use. One of the best features of the HSA is that money not spent from the account in a given year can be carried over to accumulate an emergency health care fund that you control. Imagine that. You control the money and not the government!

Support Retail Health Clinics. Wal-Mart and Target are opening health clinics in many of their stores. They are doing it despite some opposition from state bureaucrats and objections from some health professionals. These clinics are not hospitals, but they provide convenient and affordable basic services to millions of people. The clinics are staffed with medical professionals, and of course these retailers know that most people will fill their prescriptions in their stores and pick up some other items before they leave. So what?

Implement Tort Reform. When it costs doctors an average of $250,000 for malpractice insurance, something is wrong. This is driving a lot of doctors away from medicine and out of small towns that cannot generate this kind of medical ante. People's legal rights need to be protected, but not to the extent that it eliminates health care in some areas altogether.

Provide Vouchers for the Working Poor and Chronically Ill. Brilliant! It is the same principle as providing food stamps for the people who need help buying food. Just like we would not ration food to make sure we feed the poor, we should not ration health care to take care of those who do not have it. Fix the "leaks” in the roof.

Every nation that has gone the route of socialized medicine has made access, cost and quality of care worse. We have an opportunity to get it right. Then why are the Democrats in Congress and the Obama Administration determined to take the U.S. in the same direction?
It’s not about health care, it’s about control."

People who think that the Healthcare Bill will solve everything are drinking the Koolaid and don't even know the flavor. People aren't dropped because they get sick. People buy coverage IN CASE they get injured or sick. What would be the point of buying health insurance if they drop you as soon as you are injured? Think about it... that doesn't make any sense! My uncle had cancer for 16 years before finally passing away and his insurance covered practically everything. He wasn't a CEO or a district manager. He was a produce manager and night stocker at a grocery store. This is about controlling your heath, therefore, controlling you.
 
I have had a HSA for 4 years now; @ first the intrest rate was 5% now it's 3.5%; I'm one of the lucky ones that my employer takes care of the $4500 deductible; by far this is the best thing that I've seen in a very long time; I'm allowed to contribute another $2000 if I want to. If I don't use it it rolls over next year; plus, I can use it for anything health related; this year I'm using it for my daughters braces...2500 bones up front; I know a lot of people who couldn't front that much out of pocket. At 65 I can use that money for anything, so it's almost a retirement fund if you have anything left over.

Whatever Congress comes up with the members better be on the same plan that I'm on
 
All you fucking right wing Conservatives around here.......brings a tear to my eye and makes me feel at home.
 
Better to be a right wing than a left wing, because if your a left wing your not right, but if your a right wing your right, right?
 
Soldier4Real said:
All you fucking right wing Conservatives around here.......brings a tear to my eye and makes me feel at home.
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One thing I've learned in my short life is that you cannot change the view & beliefs of people; that's why in a compromise you meet in the middle.
 
Shoot yeah you can change people's views. Gunboat Diplomacy, anyone?

Also, I'm not a right wing conservative. I'm a card-carrying Libertarian. I know business and common sense. The ObamaCare Bill isn't efficient or a real cure for the problem that no one denies. It just doesn't make sense.

Oh, I'm not all about screwing over the little guy. But the little guy needs to learn how to plan for bad things and suck it up and get a crappy job until the economy recovers. People are just upset because they cannot live the lifestyle that they used to and most of those people are the bloody reason we're in this mess in the first place! They were living beyond their means, buying $750k houses and $50k cars on a total of 80-100k a year for the household. If they were smart, they'd sell the house, sell their new cars or give up their leases, buy a smaller house and buy an older used car. A very large problem is that people don't understand keeping to a budget. The credit card is gone and they don't know how to keep away from the Starbucks $5 coffees. Being fiscally responsible is very important! Especially now of all times!

And there are jobs out there. I see "Looking for Work" signs all the time and there are plenty of listings on monster.com. When I reached the age to work, I got a job at a grocery store and worked there for six months until IBM hired me on as a paid intern. There are jobs out there. They aren't glamorous by any means, but its better than nothing. I went to school, got my education, and make smart choices and that's why I'm at where I am. Hard work will take you places. Sitting on your ass and expecting something for nothing was never a good work ethic. Money doesn't grow on trees, regardless of what this administration thinks...

Back in the day before all this entitlement, if you didn't pull your weight and go to work, you would die of starvation. The people that actually, you know, WORK shouldn't have to pay for all the slackers out there. This bill would encourage the same entitlement/wellfare attitude that keeps many people out there from getting a job. Why get a job when you can vote for the people who will give you money for free? Entitlement and wealth-envy is ruining America.
 
Nah it was just a joke anyway. I lean more to the conservative side but do have some liberal views towards other things.
 
hmm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_life_expectancy

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_Canadian_and_American_health_care_systems

"One indicator of the consequences of Americans' inconsistent health care coverage is a study in Health Affairs that concluded that half of personal bankruptcies involved medical bills."

"Cato Institute has expressed concerns that the U.S. government has restricted the freedom of Medicare patients to spend their own money on health care, and has contrasted these developments with the situation in Canada, where in 2005 the Supreme Court of Canada ruled that the province of Quebec could not prohibit its citizens from purchasing covered services through private health insurance. The institute has urged the Congress to restore the right of American seniors to spend their own money on medical care.[48]"

"In a letter to the Wall Street Journal, the President and CEO of University Health Network, Toronto, said that Michael Moore's film Sicko "exaggerated the performance of the Canadian health system — there is no doubt that too many patients still stay in our emergency departments waiting for admission to scarce hospital beds." However, "Canadians spend about 55% of what Americans spend on health care and have longer life expectancy, and lower infant mortality rates. Many Americans have access to quality health care. All Canadians have access to similar care at a considerably lower cost." There is "no question" that the lower cost has come at the cost of "restriction of supply with sub-optimal access to services," said Bell. A new approach is targeting waiting times, which are reported on public websites"

Good read. (stop calling Canadian medicine socialized) No system is perfect, as both countries have seen. (this would be why both countries are looking at change!)

and yes balls, i have been to Canada...
 
Boon I just wish the republicans would say stuff like that...actual plans for how to fix health care and not just constant opposition to the democratic health care bill. They are just being obstructionist instead of trying to fix it. Obama has conceded the public option, then he conceded a medicare buy-in for 55-year-olds...those were the main things that the republicans were so opposed to, and each time one of them gets knocked off, you would think there would be less opposition...but there isn't. That's what I don't get.
 
Tee.Kay. said:
Boon I just wish the republicans would say stuff like that...actual plans for how to fix health care and not just constant opposition to the democratic health care bill. They are just being obstructionist instead of trying to fix it. Obama has conceded the public option, then he conceded a medicare buy-in for 55-year-olds...those were the main things that the republicans were so opposed to, and each time one of them gets knocked off, you would think there would be less opposition...but there isn't. That's what I don't get.
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There are MANY Republicans who support different health care legislation like the one I listed, but the Democratic majority can vote over them and prevent them from presenting it and the media refuses to cover the OTHER plans because they are in Obama's pocket. The Democratic majority in the House and Senate want this ObamaCare passed so that they can control our medicine and us. Call it conspiracy theory if you want, but its true. If its so great, why have they made themselves exempt from the same care we would receive? If it's so wonderful and provides such great care, then why are the people behind the wheel excusing themselves from it? Because it isn't. Simple as that.

There are members of both the House and Senate on the Democratic side that haven't even READ the bill, yet they are voting on it because their party told them to. That is not being responsible for the sake of their constituents. You don't play politics when people's lives, and futures, are at stake. That's why the Republicans want to stop the bill, not to kill poor people or whatever sinister plot you think they are involved in. They want a different bill, one with less government involvement and more freedom of choice. I know because I've talked with Representative John Linder and Senator Saxby Chambliss in person and they want to get rid of the things that make health care too expensive and allow free market and competition to lower prices the natural way without sacrificing care or rationing it. If we allowed taxfree healthcare savings accounts, allowed cross-state insurance purchases, and the other things listed in my earlier post, we wouldn't need government involvement. There is no better way to lower costs than to make it profitable to businesses. Capitalism is the answer, not socialistic practices.
 
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