shimytangtang
Registered User
- Joined
- Jan 14, 2021
- Messages
- 3
This rule intends to address a complex issue for which there is no simple solution. I appreciate the effort to prevent the undesirable forms of gameplay like griefing and spawncamping. Nobody likes getting blown up on the runway, or getting bombarded by UCAVs from someone hiding in their spawn. However I think the rule is flawed, and an admin who takes the rule verbatim will create an unfun and confusing playing experience.
The flaw:
Simply put, there is no in-game mechanic that allows players to reliably know whether they are in their own spawn zone or not. Players can only assume it's centroid is where the vehicles and players spawn, and it's boundaries are somewhere between that centroid and the nearest flags. As there are many maps of varying sizes and playstyles, this relative position can vary drastically from map to map. Because this boundary is ill-defined from the player's perspective, it is unfair to punish them purely on a "in spawn" or "out of spawn" basis. Additionally, the rule disregards indirect forms of inflicting damage, as well as complicated situations where combat occurs near the spawn boundary involving multiple players. Is it okay to laser designate from spawn? If someone laser designates me while I am in spawn, am I allowed to break the rule in order to defend myself? What if, just outside the spawn boundary, two tanks are battling? Can a tank on the spawn edge interfere to help his teammate? These issues result in a difficult problem regarding enforcement.
The issue with enforcement:
The best way to highlight the issues is by example. Lets say there is a US tank pushing E on Dawnbreaker, right next to the CN spawn. He is very close to the spawn boundary, but focused on attacking E. Another player on the CN side spawns into a chopper, lifts off in spawn, and begins flying towards E. Before the chopper fully exits spawn, it begins taking fire from that tank's gunner. The chopper destroys the attacking tank, however, he is still technically in the spawn zone. The admin saw the chopper kill the tank from spawn, so he kills the chopper as punishment. Who was really at fault? And were either the chopper or the tank even taking part in what could be considered "spawncamping", "griefing", or "baseraping"? I believe enforcing the rule in this manner completely misses the intended purpose of the rule, and only serves to frustrate the players. Neither the chopper or the tank had intentions of spawnkilling, or abusing the spawn zone boundaries. This kind of combat occurs frequently on smaller maps, or maps where the spawn zone is close to a flag. I experienced several similar situations while playing on TBG servers over the past couple of days, some in which I was the one being killed by admin, others where it was someone else. I even got killed by an admin in a chopper for using the skyscrapers as cover on Dawnbreaker, which is a necessary part of helicopter gameplay to avoid getting shredded by MAA, or to replenish countermeasures. It seemed the main problem was one admin in particular, who I will not name in this post, but it was clear he had no intentions of reasoning with any of the complaining players in the chat.
I have been playing BF4 on and off since launch. I must have at least 1000 hours logged, many of those hours on TBG servers, and I have never experienced this kind of admin behavior until now. Perhaps some changes could be made to the rule's wording, or a discussion could take place with the admins to clarify when and why a player should be killed/kicked. Is a player repeatedly UCAVing from spawn when their team has flags? Kill him. Is a jet destroying the enemy planes before they can lift off? Kick him. But I'd argue many of the edge cases (literally) in which players have been getting killed by admin do not warrant such punishment, if any.
I hope this post does not come across as an attack on anyone or a call for some kind of punishment. I am just an avid battlefield fan concerned about the direction of one of my favorite BF4 servers.
The flaw:
Simply put, there is no in-game mechanic that allows players to reliably know whether they are in their own spawn zone or not. Players can only assume it's centroid is where the vehicles and players spawn, and it's boundaries are somewhere between that centroid and the nearest flags. As there are many maps of varying sizes and playstyles, this relative position can vary drastically from map to map. Because this boundary is ill-defined from the player's perspective, it is unfair to punish them purely on a "in spawn" or "out of spawn" basis. Additionally, the rule disregards indirect forms of inflicting damage, as well as complicated situations where combat occurs near the spawn boundary involving multiple players. Is it okay to laser designate from spawn? If someone laser designates me while I am in spawn, am I allowed to break the rule in order to defend myself? What if, just outside the spawn boundary, two tanks are battling? Can a tank on the spawn edge interfere to help his teammate? These issues result in a difficult problem regarding enforcement.
The issue with enforcement:
The best way to highlight the issues is by example. Lets say there is a US tank pushing E on Dawnbreaker, right next to the CN spawn. He is very close to the spawn boundary, but focused on attacking E. Another player on the CN side spawns into a chopper, lifts off in spawn, and begins flying towards E. Before the chopper fully exits spawn, it begins taking fire from that tank's gunner. The chopper destroys the attacking tank, however, he is still technically in the spawn zone. The admin saw the chopper kill the tank from spawn, so he kills the chopper as punishment. Who was really at fault? And were either the chopper or the tank even taking part in what could be considered "spawncamping", "griefing", or "baseraping"? I believe enforcing the rule in this manner completely misses the intended purpose of the rule, and only serves to frustrate the players. Neither the chopper or the tank had intentions of spawnkilling, or abusing the spawn zone boundaries. This kind of combat occurs frequently on smaller maps, or maps where the spawn zone is close to a flag. I experienced several similar situations while playing on TBG servers over the past couple of days, some in which I was the one being killed by admin, others where it was someone else. I even got killed by an admin in a chopper for using the skyscrapers as cover on Dawnbreaker, which is a necessary part of helicopter gameplay to avoid getting shredded by MAA, or to replenish countermeasures. It seemed the main problem was one admin in particular, who I will not name in this post, but it was clear he had no intentions of reasoning with any of the complaining players in the chat.
I have been playing BF4 on and off since launch. I must have at least 1000 hours logged, many of those hours on TBG servers, and I have never experienced this kind of admin behavior until now. Perhaps some changes could be made to the rule's wording, or a discussion could take place with the admins to clarify when and why a player should be killed/kicked. Is a player repeatedly UCAVing from spawn when their team has flags? Kill him. Is a jet destroying the enemy planes before they can lift off? Kick him. But I'd argue many of the edge cases (literally) in which players have been getting killed by admin do not warrant such punishment, if any.
I hope this post does not come across as an attack on anyone or a call for some kind of punishment. I am just an avid battlefield fan concerned about the direction of one of my favorite BF4 servers.
